Occupy is a Social Movement. Every social movement in history goes through the same phases.
1. A problem is realized.
2. Civil unrest occurs.
3. The movement grows.
From here, one of two things ALWAYS occurs:
A. The movement organizes and identifies leaders with clear vision, message & goals (Ghandi, ML King etc…) and continues to grow – eventually realizing significant change on a permanent basis.
OR
B. The movement does not organize and develops no clear vision, message or goals. Constant in-fighting, lack of vision and lack of a clearly understandable message causes the movement to lose momentum and eventually fail.
Occupy is at the turning point. Either "A" or "B" IS going to occur. There is no getting around it. I have been to camps and talked with people around the country is "B" is the overwhelming trend. Lots of bickering, contradiction and nothing getting done. A dozen different ideas about goals that should be pursued with nothing ever being done about any of them.
Guess what? If this doesn't change, we're going to fail. Period.
Lawmakers aren't going to change things because people in tents bang on drums. That got their attention but it won't get action. Have you seen a single piece of legislation introduced or discussed to address any of the goals of OWS? No. Because no one knows what the hell the movement wants. Ask 50 Occupiers, you get 40 different messages. Violence, Destruction, Law-Breaking and Rape are what the media prefers to cover because it's sensational and increases ratings. At least until someone is able to say "I speak for Occupy and here is our message."
CEO's certainly aren't going to give up their multi-million dollar jobs or stop making profits. They would be foolish to do so. Their jobs is to make profits. That's why they're hired. It's a matter of making it worth it, for them to look at the human cost of those profits. But banging on drums won't amke them think about this.
So it's time for some of us to start something new. We don't need to disassociate ourselves from OWS but we do need to create something that people can understand and get behind. If we don't, the movement will definitely fail.
We cannot take over companies. There is no peaceful, legal way to do so. So our only alternative is to go after our corrupt government. You can bang on drums or write a thousand posts about why this should be repealed or that should occur but until you develop a clear vision and get people into action toward those specific goals, you will accomplish nothing.
Most of you will read this and do nothing. To those of you ready to do something: Time for us to network and organize. To develop a clear message & vision. To educate people on the change we seek and why that will be good for them. Otherwise, why should they care? They need to know the difference between capitlaism and consumerism. Between a Democratic Republic and a Corporatacracy.
I don't care if you want to lead or you want me to. But we need leadership or we're nothing more than a novelty. Time to organize a political force to be reckoned with. Contact me. Let's talk about how to build voter blocs. Develop a clear message. Make permanent change and history in the process.
Why exactly do we need a leader? From my experience and understanding, the pros and cons of having a leader weigh more on the con side. Why? Because leaders become increasingly valuable that the position of leader calls for a certain type of person to maintain the true role of a leader. Not only that, a leader has to become everything from bullet proof to mentally stable enough to not become paranoid of those wanting or envying their position. And what is the leader suppose to do? Make the decisions that will cause division or even take the movement in another direction? History is riddled with bad endings of movements with leaders.
typicalowsguy, if you feel as if the movement needs a leader or leadership…Be the leader or the leadership. There is no guarantee I will follow you. And there is also no guarantee that those affiliated with OWS will follow you either. The leaderless movement encourages everybody who wants to 'partake in the occupation' to be leaders themselves. Ala spread the responsibility. My idea is as good as anybody else, as well as yours typicalowsguy. That is the beauty, everybody has a voice, the hardship is to all agree on various items to move things forward. There is no easy way to do this. It will take work and it will take perceiving things beyond ourselves to be able to see the collective picture. For me, as long as it is to the betterment of every single person in existence now and to come. I am for it. I am doing my role as a leader, in my own sphere to forward goal. Ending the corruption of government by multinational corporations is a good start.
What was the goal of the colonist when they decided to break away from the Crown? Was it cohesive? Was there consensus? Did the tenets of the movement happen within a few weeks? Months? Years?
I agree, we have to start planning for the next stage of action. I have suggested changing the name or adopting a new one which will make more people who aren't able to 'occupy' feel more part of the movement, for example. There is a lot to be done on informing people and raising awareness. As far as I am concerned, that should be the main priority right now. Don't worry about putting out a message, I think we should do more listening and I feel, the message will come out of those people who aren't truly aware how bad the situation is. I find, just in talking to people, one way or another people are feeling the pressure from the 1 percent. There are few people who I talk to who isn't complaining about some aspect of society that is riddled with corporate malfeasance. Whether they are aware of the corporate malfeasance in the background or not. Talk to people and raise awareness. I realized this the other day while passing out Occupy Houston newspapers, I stopped in the Gamestop in passing…because I am gamer….and I ended up talking to the Game Stop employee about what I was doing. We ended up talking for about 30 mins about the situation of the economy, immigration and the like. Go out and talk to people and let them know that their situation is not an isolated one and that EVERYBODY is feeling it. Maybe then, we will have the numbers and the Messiah will arise from the masses…
Post edited 4:27 pm – November 29, 2011 by Anon580
Good day, Typicalowsguy,
It's good to have your attention. One key is a database to organize for the information of the Movement's collective progress, that monitors categories of law and identifies areas requiring attention, action, support, media-campaign or contribution.
Wikileaks proposed the The Global Square: Towards an Online Platform for the Occupy Movement.
Occupystream.com is for the live streams of Occupied cites,
that is designated for Public relations and we understand that many of the channels are amateur. We do ask the channel moderators if they will help organize media campaigns or categorize topics for groups to petition representatives and the City Council to address. There is a strong sense of community amongst the people 'on the ground' for social awareness.
movetoammend.org and the National Lawyers Guild are managing some of the important legal aspects.
One of the biggest issues is need for direct supervision of the Congress in order to successfully:
1. Restore Glass-Steagall Act of 1933
2. Reverse Citizens United
3. *Apply Direct Democracy to Federal Budget Appropriation*
It is a given that The People will expect all public servants whom are violators of the constitution to be prosecuted. The occupiers 'on the ground' are stating some of these specific requests at General Assembly meetings. The general assembly minutes usually identify only the nature of requests to government, as they are not aware of which or how many statues may apply.
3. Apply Direct Democracy to Federal Budget Appropriation
There are well organized, well funded groups, and millions of intelligent people that dont want any of those things to happens. Because the movement wants those things, doesnt mean it'll happen. So what's the plan? Leadership, in whatever form it takes, seems necessary.
Post edited 4:51 pm – November 29, 2011 by Anon580
Hello, NotRich,
I agree that there will be powerful oppositions.
We are expecting particular Representatives and Senate and City Council and Mayors to help support the bills needed to accomplish the goals. Some of them who are well-experienced and have a well-established reputation in law have already shown some interest in this. I had collected a lot of information but yesterday my hard-drive crashed. There are quite of few that I will have to re-locate. One that was distinguished is:
Nov18: Special Order Speech By House Rep. Paul Broun of Georgia – Behaviors that occurred locally for which no evidence of substantial economic impact was presented, had been regulated by force of the Federal jurisdiction through means of the Commerce Clause. This legal behavior in several cases went against the original intent of Congressional authority to regulate inter-state commerce. Swift & Co. v. US, 1905. Stafford v. Wallace, 1921. Wickard v. Filburn, 1942. US v. Lopez, 1995.
The lastest successful operation for the occupy movement 'on the ground' is that:
'there are now 9 pending investigations into the #UCDavis pepper spray incident' and including Berkeley:
What's next? That's the question being asked as cities close down Occupy encampments and winter approaches.
The answer is simple. Just as the Tea Party gained power, the Occupy Movement can. The Occupy movement has raised awareness of a great many of America's real issues and has organized supporters across the country. Next comes electoral power. Wall Street exerts its force through the money that buys elections and elected officials. But ultimately, the outcome of elections depends on people willing to take to the streets — registering voters, knocking on doors, distributing information, speaking in local venues. The way to change the nation is to occupy elections.
Whatever Occupiers may think of the Democrats, they can gain power within the Democratic Party and hence in election contests all over America. All they have to do is join Democratic Clubs, stick to their values, speak out very loudly, and work in campaigns for candidates at every level who agree with their values. If Occupiers can run tent camps, organize food kitchens and clean-up brigades, run general assemblies, and use social media, they can take over and run a significant part of the Democratic Party.
To what end? All the hundreds of the occupiers' legitimate complaints and important policy suggestions follow from a simple general moral principle: American democracy is about citizens caring about one another and acting responsibly on that care.
Do I hold my nose when it comes to voting for a Democrat candidate? Yes, I do, but only because at present there is no truly viable alternative. (And please, don't bring Ron Paul into this discussion.) But if we don't insert ourselves into the electoral process in a big way there will not be any change that the sacrificing of comfort and safety by camping in parks has hoped to bring about.
So in this I don't know that either "A" or "B" has to happen.
Of all the animals, man is the only one that is cruel. He is the only one that inflicts pain for the pleasure of doing it.
So in this I don't know that either "A" or "B" has to happen.
It is really tempting to try to align with a political party, but that would limit us. I intend to vote and hope most others do too. The problem is that occupy is bigger than a single election. If we occupy the Democratic party, which I think would be pretty easy, we limit ourselves to changing only part of the elected officials. The way we are now, there is pressure on all of them. Sure, the right is trying to demonize us, but in time the pressure will be enough to move all of them. Yes, voting is an important part of occupy, but we are the 99% not just a political party.
It is really tempting to try to align with a political party, but that would limit us. I intend to vote and hope most others do too. The problem is that occupy is bigger than a single election. If we occupy the Democratic party, which I think would be pretty easy, we limit ourselves to changing only part of the elected officials. The way we are now, there is pressure on all of them. Sure, the right is trying to demonize us, but in time the pressure will be enough to move all of them. Yes, voting is an important part of occupy, but we are the 99% not just a political party.
Where is anyone talking about a single election? Of course every movement for change is going to be longer than any one election. As for aligning with a party, where else to go right now but the Dems? At the same time a person can build the Green party also, or any party of personal choice. But occupying the Dem party on the local level makes sense right now. You not only radicalize your precinct and affect them, you push the needs of the 99% into the offices of government. And THAT is where legislation that changes finance laws regarding elections gets changed, that is where laws governing much of corporate greed are made.
As for the pressure to change those in office? Look at the slippage in the GOP in Washington right now, where there are Senators who are giving up ground in regards to finance of extending the payroll tax cut. It is only because of the Occupy movement that has brought the inequalities in this country. Occupy has done what the Dem party has not been able to do! Occupy scores victory against Republicans
"We are the 99% not just a political party." If the 99% doesn't get unified behind something my fear is it will end up withering away. It has to go somewhere and what with the hesitancy to go without any one leader or leaders the masses have to do something and get involved in something tangible like changing elections.
Of all the animals, man is the only one that is cruel. He is the only one that inflicts pain for the pleasure of doing it.
it would be highly naive to think that one party is better than the other. follow the money – they're all on the take. just because they are liberal doesnt mean they take less money than the other. just because they talk about alignment with the movement does no mean that they havent been part of the very system that the movement has worked against.
the election finance laws have been bi-partisan, specifically mccain-feingold. Citizens United is a rightwing group, but the case was upheld by the supreme court, not congress or the president. the citizens united case stated that both corporations and unions have first amendment rights. so in this instance, the legislation was intended to do one thing, but the courts said another.
obama just had a 10k per plate fundraising dinner in NYC. are those donors part of the 99%? i could feed my family of 5 for 2 years on $10,000. it's absolute bullshit to think that Dems are the only path. that's not meant to attack anyone's opinion, but lets not get suckered into thinking about one party or another.
the Tea Party chose their candidates, not their party. they had directly opposed incumbent candidates that didnt fit into what they wanted to see in elected officials. in many, many cases they campaigned for their candidate, who many times went on to win their primary and then their general election, unseating the incumbent.
my guess is that the movement would be wise to critically inspect the record of every dem AND republican.
Just as the tea drinkers have made their presence in the GOP a fact and have forced them even further to the right there should be, IMO anyway, some force pushing an opposition party the opposite way. Doing so does not have to compromise anyone into duplicity with big money lobbyists or their money.
However of course there's always the building of a third party. Something that is needed and long overdue. How about the Occupy Party? Of course that means there would have to be a leadership of some sort and a candidate of course. Can a leaderless movement have a leader or leadership group? A candidate who speaks for them? Time to think about these things. Failure or success depends on the answers.
As far as the tea party the conservative wing of the GOP (read Koch brothers) actually chose the tea candidates. There was a great fear that the GOP was becoming too liberal. Well, they seem to have fixed that.
Of all the animals, man is the only one that is cruel. He is the only one that inflicts pain for the pleasure of doing it.
Soon, I expect there will be some clear leaders presenting for the Occupy Movement. However, the original intention I believe was that the Idea are the Leader and the presenter's of the Idea can be rotated through an 'operating system'. That is how the group Anonymous has become successful, by the creation of Operations which through consensual agreement were enacted.
Soon, I expect there will be some clear leaders presenting for the Occupy Movement. However, the original intention I believe was that the Idea are the Leader and the presenter's of the Idea can be rotated through an 'operating system'. That is how the group Anonymous has become successful, by the creation of Operations which through consensual agreement were enacted.
And how is this played out in a nation wide movement? A convention perhaps?
Of all the animals, man is the only one that is cruel. He is the only one that inflicts pain for the pleasure of doing it.
I would think before you can align yourself with any party. They first must let you in. At this time I only see people moving away from OWS. You have a major image problem. Hell Obama will need every vote he can get to stay in office. Im sure he will take you but wont support you. Has there been any senator or house member at any rallies, Yes a few mayors, But where, In so far left Oakland the slum of cali. Please post a video of any support. Without it you are done. With it they are done. They like there job more than OWS. I could be wrong but someone needs to post up.
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